Beginner question about pedal timing

Actually finding videos was harder, because that's not the view we usually get to see. I was looking for a particular one but can't find it.

Horowitz we only see in the beginning. His left foot goes to different places. How do we stay balanced on the tripod which is our seat and two feet while also doing delicate things with the pedal?

This camera has a static view so we can see feet throughout. Mostly his feet are over the pedal because pedal is so frequent. At 12:49 when the other pianist has a long solo passage, his feet go to the floor.

Mozart - more like the kind of music you're playing - pedal continually used for subtle shading, so foot stays over the pedal.

I don't know if this gives any insights or feel.

iternabe BTW The sustain pedal I have for my digital piano has fairly good resistance. And I have read that on acoustic piano it is possible to adjust the pedal tension so that just resting the full weight of the foot on the pedal (ankle on the floor of course) would not push it down.

This is true (except for "ankle on the floor" ). The angle of the foot matters a lot too. I have an acoustic and it's on caster cups. My pedals are 3 inches from the floor. This was a huge adjustment when it was new. I had to get a little platform to rest my heel on, and I had to try about 10 pairs of shoes (and many pedal tension adjustments) to finally get things dialled in. The only shoes that work are a pair of wedge sandals with a 2" heel. These allow me to rest my foot on the pedal without it moving. With other shoes, I had to hold my foot up a little, and after 30+ min of playing I would feel a very uncomfortable strain/fatigue in my shin. With my previous piano this was never even something I had to think about...the pedals were very close to the floor.

iternabe Oops, meant to say “heel on the floor”.

I know...but it was a funny image to go along with WieWaldi's "pedaling with the ears."

JB_PT I have an acoustic and it's on caster cups. My pedals are 3 inches from the floor.

I have my digital cabinet on shock absorvers (one inch higher) to dampen impact sound, so the people living the floor under me won't hear anymore my playing noise. This little extra inch was already very uncomfortable for me to pedal. I solved it by attaching a door-mat to a wooden board (60x40cm) under the pedals to have my feet at pedal level again. This works quite well.

And this brings me to another thing I was thinking for quite a while: About height of the keyboard of acoustics and digital cabinets. It seems there is a standard height, isn't it? And this standard was established a long time ago when people where smaller on average. For big people nowadays, the keyboard height could be too low from an ergonomic perspective. Ok, with casters the entire piano can be lifted completely, but then the pedals are lifted off the ground, too. And this makes it uncomfortable to play. AFAIK some companies like Bösendorfer offers modification kits to extend the length of the lyra (don't know the english word for the housing for the rods to the pedals). And indeed I can imagine for a grand piano, this work very well. But what about uprights? Is there a way to extend the keyboard-pedal distance at all?

WieWaldi But what about uprights? Is there a way to extend the keyboard-pedal distance at all?

Not sure - everything is enclosed in the cabinet so it doesn’t seem like it would be practical. I searched this topic when I was first dealing with it and it seemed like the standard solution was a platform similar to mine. I wish this was something the piano store had discussed with me prior to delivery, perhaps even offering solutions. It was quite a shock at first…I could not use the pedals at all because it was so uncomfortable.

Side note but still on the topic of pedaling The next piece in my book introduces something new: finger pedaling. I got all nervous... I had images like WieWaldi pedaling with his ear:

But then I watched Gale explain it, and it's not quite as scary as all that Learn something every day!

WieWaldi What is finger pedaling?

Finger pedaling just means that you hold down some notes (usually the bass) with your fingers rather than sustain them with the pedal. It doesn't necessarily require finger switching.

BartK Isn't this the most normal thing, all we beginner pianists do before we reach out for the pedal?
Ok - someone for sure invented a name for it to make it feel as complicated as hell.

WieWaldi BartK Isn't this the most normal thing, all we beginner pianists do before we reach out for the pedal?

But finger pedaling doesn't mean that you simply play notes with your fingers. It means specifically that you hold them longer as if they were being sustained by the pedal but without using the pedal. For example, if you have an Alberti bass pattern that goes C-G-E-G you would hold down the C for the whole beat while playing G-E-G. Another example is playing an arpeggio while holding down all the previous notes of the arpeggio. This way you sustain the notes while avoiding muddiness. It is useful sometimes.

This is the notation my book uses:

The first note in bass staff is a full note, meaning to hold it down the entire bar length, anyway. This is a good example why the pedal marking is superfluous.

I think the pedal is still needed for the right hand, so that those notes sound nice too. I haven't started that piece yet though

What I like about following all three method books: they don't cover everything at once. In the first two books they didn't cover much theory at all, because they know we beginners just like to touch the piano And our brains are not ready yet for super complicated techniques, we struggle enough just reading the score, finding the notes and making our fingers obey.

But now the third Alfred book is starting to apply the thumbscrews... circle of fifths, more chords, more scales, diminished 7th chords and soon arpeggios. Another buzz word everyone keeps telling us they are so important... but I was patient and waited for Alfred to introduce all those things. That gives me time to also do stuff I like, such as the blues course

Actually I am really loving this third book though. Towards the end it will allow us to play some actual music, such as original versions of the first movement of Moonlight Sonata and Fur Elise. But I am starting to think that my first love might become lighter music such as blues and easy listening... it's too early to tell still.

Either way, we need to continue to learn - and this forum is really helpful in providing both tips and motivation

Sophia diminished 7th chords

Fuuu**** - Christian has only introduced a half-dimished one so far. (D minor seven flat five). I start to feel like I am lagging behind.

Sophia circle of fifths

Look up where your 12-bar blues chords are inside this circle. And if he starts more advanced chord progressions, look up again where they are located. This tells quite you something about what sounds good or bad.

On a digital piano this isn't always clear but on an accoustic there is a big difference in sound because of the resonance of all the open strings when you lift the pedal. The piece tempo direction is "Majestically", which means you're trying to get this big resonant sound with all the strings open. Nothing bad is going to happen if you don't press the pedal immediately but it's not going to sound as majestic. On a good piano you should be able to hear the difference.

Pallas The pedaling mark is telling you where the composer wants which kind of resonance from the instrument.

Well, the composer in this case is Handel, who knew nothing about the piano pedal because it wasn't invented yet. The pedal marks are an editorial addition.

Usually, pedal marks are a suggestion anyway, even when the composer wrote them.

/end nitpicking mode