@pianoloverus @ShiroKuro the door is an opening into the family room from the sitting room. The place I took the photo from (the camera) has a large opening into the foyer.

The wall adjacent (to the piano cutout) has a forced air vent , so does the other short wall (by the foyer). The opposite side to the door has a large window .

So I'm a bit constrained...

Those pesky vents and windows… 😅

@raagamuffin we can’t really tell if it will work or not without being in the room ourselves. Could you set up some boxes and other large items, drop them with a sheet or something, to try to simulate the actual 3D size of the piano? And put a chair just in the doorway. That might give you an better idea?

pianoloverus So you are saying that if I were to compare a Kawai K300 with a K500 and a K800
they would all sound the same and the only difference would be the height and the price?
I don't think so! Because that is what you sound like you are implying!

      brdwyguy Not at all. Please read the comment I was responding to in order to understand what I meant. When I was talking about all things being equal I was saying that pianos like the ones you mentioned or any series of pianos from the same maker usually have the same "basic" design other than length and price. Just like there are great similarities between Mason A and a Mason AA. Of course not meaning they sound the same because if that was true why would any reasonable person by the larger more expensive piano?

          pianoloverus

          When I was talking about all things being equal I was saying that pianos like the ones you mentioned or any series of pianos from the same maker usually have the same "basic" design other than length and price.

          That is not always true. Using the Kawai upright example that Brdwyguy mentioned, the K-500 adds higher spec features beyond just height, string length, and soundboard area relative to the K-300, such as a partial duplex scale and bass agraffes. The K-800 adds a full duplex scale, a full set of agraffes (excluding the top octave as is customary) and upgraded hammer felt. One should of course focus on the overall playability and sound, and not on specs, but these differ in ways that often are associated with different product lines.

          Comparing a K-300 to a K-800 is more like comparing a Yamaha U1 to a YUS5 than like comparing a U1 to a U3.

              sweelinck
              Thank You sweelinck - an interesting video:

              and this one is also interesting:

                  I don't think you should have any fears buying from Cunningham! @Rich-Galassini is very active on PW (don't know if he'll see this tag here) and from everything I've heard and seen over the years of posts I have no doubt that Cunningham will take care of you. If I was shopping on the East Coast I'd definitely consider buying from them.

                  brdwyguy

                  In the case of Kawai K series uprights, even the tonal style varies. I think that is less true of Kawai grands at least within the GX and SK series. The tonal style of Boston uprights also seemed more uniform, at least with the 126 and 132 models (much moreso than with the K-500 and K-800).

                  Robert Estrin demonstrated the tonal consistency of a Baldwin/Hamilton studio upright and Baldwin 7' grand in this video:

                  These pianos clearly have very different designs, but both were engineered to deliver Baldwin's tonal signature at the time.

                  Short of confirmation from Kawai, I have no way to verify this, but it currently is my speculative belief that Kawai designs the K-500 and ST-1 to have a little heavier action and warmer tone than the K-300 or K-800 have so that they will require less voicing and regulation maintenance in heavy use institutional settings.

                  The upshot of all of that is that pianos of different length have different scale designs. That the same woods, design and build methods are used may contribute to tonal consistency, but ultimately, I think if there is a consistency of tonal style across a product line, it is engineered in as a design goal.

                    raagamuffin
                    We tried uprights, though not that particular Kawai.

                    If you can stretch your budget to consider a Kawai K-800 (some indeterminate number less than $18K, varying with negotiated price, say $17,500 for the sake of discussion, but could be less), it has the keystick length, fallboard style, music rack style, and sostenuto pedal found in a grand. Keysticks are longer than you will find in most small grands (closer to the key length of a 7' grand).

                      sweelinck I know that,of course. That's why I used the word "basic" which IMO allows for higher spec features.

                        Regarding uprights, I would audition Schimmel and Gotrian uprights. I felt they were better (action, sound, etc) than the lower tier grand piano offerings.

                        I would also consider finding a reputable used piano seller (like Cunningham) and consider a -newer- used piano. There is a significant quality delta at your price point. E.g. used Yamaha CX vs a new Yamaha G.

                        I found Larry Fine's "The Piano Book" very helpful when looking at pianos.

                        After much debate, we purchased the Cunningham 5'. I didn't see a big difference between that and the 5'4. We replayed the Kawai GL20 and felt it was a bit brighter, so went back to it. My daughter didn't prefer an upright, due to staring into a black wood column (according to her), she'd rather stare at a blank wall 😉

                        I'll update after delivery and debate with (in a friendly way , of course) @pianoloverus and @ShiroKuro if its aesthetic or not!
                        I will say, pricing is very opaque in this industry, I think I may have overpaid (or paid exactly what I should have), its tough to tell.

                          raagamuffin, Cunningham's are top of the line beginner pianos, perfect to start out on and to eventually trade up if need be in the future.

                          Here is the page from Larry Fine's Piano Buyer Guide, in case you didn't see it:
                          https://www.pianobuyer.com/copy-of-template-43

                          Can't wait to see pictures and maybe even a video?
                          brdwyguy

                          raagamuffin wooo hoooo!!! Congratulations!!! I think you’ll be very happy with it!! I am super excited for you!!

                          When do you take delivery?

                            raagamuffin congratulations! I look forward to seeing the photos. It’s very exciting to get a new piano!

                              @raagamuffin Congratulations! And in terms of the price you paid, unless money is very tight, I wouldn't worry about a couple of thousand dollars; you will have the piano for years!