rsl12

I agree with what HeartKeys said.

Of course I do not have the definitive answer, but after spending time with recordings and working out some arrangements, the way I humbly view it is this: the harmonic framework for each song would likely be pretty well defined (chord progressions, often used substitutions, other style-istic trademarks of his). Therefore when performing, one can be in a say semi automatic mode where one can "play around Β» up to a certain point at whim within the melody constraints. It would be a little like having a toolbox where one can pull out different tricks to suit particular musical contexts at specific points.

I may be totally out to lunch on this, btw πŸ™‚ In any case this is what I strive to do when I dabble at the keyboard in general; I seem to have certain hand imprints or accompaniment sequences which I naturally gravitate towards without having to think about it too much. Of course, my problem is that I do not have all that wide a range of such reflexes and I fall flat into the trap of sounding too repetitive, grrr…..

      HeartKeys Do you do this more on a digital or acoustic?

      Acoustic! And yes.

        HeartKeys Agreed on the pop and Taylor Swift stuff. Anytime I play that on a public piano, folks love it.

        I can't listen to any of her songs without thinking "I'm definitely not the target audience for this." But I know I should add a few to my bank of songs!

          kanadajin

          I've heard your transcriptions in the ABF recitals but I don't think I've heard you improvise yet! What are you working on now?

            Sophia I very much enjoy the fewer forum sections - it allows me to actually read everything more easily. I think "PIanist zone" covers both classical and non-classical anyway!

            I guess we should enjoy the smallness while it lasts! In PW, I was very much stuck only between the non-classical forum and the ABF recitals and nothing else. I only found out about the Navindra drama in the PW Piano Forum by accident. I would applaud you if you decide to learn how to use fake books (which is the non-sheet music route for playing pop and jazz). It's quite different and for me it was very intimidating at first.

                Thanks for the insight into Michel Legrand.

                HeartKeys I just saw some videos and read his biography and currently think it’s a combination of both improv and prepared. Very fun music he plays!

                kanadajin the way I humbly view it is this: the harmonic framework for each song would likely be pretty well defined (chord progressions, often used substitutions, other style-istic trademarks of his). Therefore when performing, one can be in a say semi automatic mode where one can "play around Β» up to a certain point at whim within the melody constraints. It would be a little like having a toolbox where one can pull out different tricks to suit particular musical contexts at specific points.

                I suspected that must be the case. I'm of two minds whether I should adopt this kind of approach. As Kanadajin(γ‚«γƒŠγƒ€δΊΊ?) notes, if you only have a limited bank of phrases (which I would have due to lack of time), it can become very repetitive. And even though it sounds wonderful as a listener, when I play jazz I'm striving to connect my spur-of-the-moment emotions and musical ideas to my fingers, and too many complicated long phrases pulls me away from that. But I do love listening to people who take this approach.

                    Bellyman I had thought about adding some vocals to what I do in the band.

                    Please do! I'm sure you've heard people say "I could never improvise--you're so lucky you were born being able to come up with music just like that." And the truth is anyone with some musical talent could learn to improvise. Well I'm pretty sure the same is often true of singing. What I've learned from voice lessons is that the professional voice sound doesn't come naturally--it comes from practicing things that to me seem extremely non-intuitive. And it would be great to have someone else trying to figure out voice at the same time as me!

                    Also, based on other stories you've told about your drummer, I don't think you should take his criticism to heart.

                        rsl12 Does this count?

                        !!

                        (Sorry I don't know yet how to make larger images small)

                        I got that in the 1990s because everyone with a guitar was supposed to have it πŸ˜ƒ However I'll be honest, I'm MILES away from trying anything just yet... I'm still at "Mary Had a Little Lamb" level. Ok, just beyond, but close πŸ˜…

                            Sophia Yes! A real book is the same thing as a fake book. Originally, there were only fake books, which were printed in the basements of university music departments. These were created without any permission from the copyright holders, and allowed musicians to "fake" their way through a performance, without the actual sheet music. So when legal version of fake books were created, they were marketed as "Real Books". Now that real books are commonplace, the illegal versions do not have to be smuggled and copied clandestinely (though people now can easily illegally obtain real books, so are they fake again?).

                            I would choose an easier fake book, though, to start with. Something like this. Or if you don't have a teacher who can teach you, something like this (sorry it's out of print--I remember looking through it and thinking it was pretty good, but I'm sure there are similar beginner-level books about using fake books).

                              I have probably played more classical than anything else, but I like listening to and playing all kinds of music. In addition to classical I've played a lot of ragtime and some new age and rock/pop from sheet music.

                              I have dabbled with lead sheets, using them to make some simple arrangements of Christmas songs. I've learned a few things by ear although I'm really slow. I need to work on my ear training!

                              These days I do a lot of improvising. I'm not trying for any genre when I improvise, I just play.

                                rogerch

                                I say this as a compliment, you remind me of Nahre Sol, who is a classically trained (Juilliard) musician who delves into different genres. It's always encouraging to me, to see folks branch out of one certain type of music. I imagine a lot of the techniques and ideas you get from one genre complements and generates ideas for the other genres.

                                    HeartKeys Wow, thanks HeartKeys! Nahre Sol is amazing and someone I look up to and have learned from so I am flattered!

                                      rsl12 Also, based on other stories you've told about your drummer, I don't think you should take his criticism to heart.

                                      I hear what you're saying. I still don't wanna open up that part of me to him. There are just certain things that aren't on the table. (Church work is one of them, long story... Been there, done that. No longer interested.)

                                      It's a bit of an odd dynamic. I sometimes think he thinks of me almost like a "son" as opposed to just someone he plays music with. He is old enough to be my dad. The other guy, the bass player, does vocals, too. But he's in between age wise and "can do no wrong". He actually has a hard time carrying a tune as well but since he's "experienced", it doesn't seem to be criticized.

                                      There are quite a few "musical" styles that I find fascinating, styles that don't seem to "carry a tune" with a lot of precision but yet are or were quite popular. Jimmy Durante. Leon Redbone. Louis Armstrong. Randy Newman. Major Holley. I'm sure there are others. But they were all kinda unique and endearing in some way. I'm still thinkin' about that.

                                      Not really sure where the current band will take me but it still seems to be expanding in the circle of influence and I'm still making new acquaintances and playing in new places that I might not be on my own. So I plan to ride this train a bit longer. Some of those connections may pay off later on when this particular band ceases to exist, and it will come to an end, just don't know when. Leader / drummer just turned 82, not in good health. But hey, one never knows.

                                        Pallas , thanks!

                                        LOL!! Probably won't be any "nose flicking" but there are just certain things I won't do for his band. Didn't say I wouldn't do them on my own. πŸ˜‰

                                        Actually, the bass player does do gigs on his own, did before he joined the band. He plays guitar and sings, probably has more gigs a year than the band does. I've not ventured out as far but could, and that might happen in the future. I've got some ideas.

                                        Actually, I could use some energy! πŸ˜ƒ I'm a part time musician. I'm also a part time farmer trying to earn a few pennies growin' and sellin' produce. (Nothin' like making money the hard way, aye? LOL! I now have two avocations that suck time and make next to no money! LOL!)

                                          I certainly hope you will accept me into this club!
                                          I am classically trained and play classical music 99% of the time, but I actually prefer to listen to film music! Here is a rare non-classical performance of mine, playing something by Enrico Morricone, one of my favorite composers:

                                          This was recorded on my former piano, a beat-up old Pease baby grand from 1911 that I restored to the best of my limited ability. You can hear how out of tune it was (it could not stay in tune no matter what) but I think it did have a pleasant tone nonetheless.

                                            Hi. Spent the last 14 years taking classical lessons and working pretty hard at it. I like classical, but always wanted to be able to sit down and play things like classic rock, blues, jazz ballads, GAS tunes, etc. So in January this year I stepped away from my lessons, first for a nice long piano break, and more recently poking around for a path to something different.
                                            This isn't very productive at the moment, but I'm giving myself a lot of leeway exploring.

                                            rsl12 how to use fake books (which is the non-sheet music route for playing pop and jazz).

                                            What is a fake book? Is this similar to lead sheets?