ShiroKuro This is a little bit awkward for me, because I am a moderator on this forum and I’m also a general participant in this thread. I may call in the other mods if I think (or anyone else thinks) I can’t be both here…
I think you handle this all very well, not getting angry, but politely requesting (twice) that dismissive and derogatory labels are not used. 
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... feeling like the pianist on the Titanic ...
JB_PT The level of sarcasm being doled out here is really baffling. I'm having a hard time understanding why some of you are so spun up about this.
Agreed! Please refrain from doing this. People here have been tolerant of skepticism and contradictory opinions. It's fine to debate back and forth, but by being sarcastic and with name-calling you end up silencing people in the discussion and making the forum worse. A simple "I don't think Molly Gebrian is effective and I think it's overblown and here's why..." would have sufficed. There's no reason to be mean-spirited about it.
Animisha ShiroKuro I suspect it's the antithesis of things she espouses these days.
I am not sure. They rather seem to address different aspects. Suzuki stresses the importance of listening to music and learning to play before learning to read. But yes, there is also every day repetition, so that part is not the same as Molly's present practice recommendations
I definitely don’t know enough about Suzuki methods really, so I shouldn’t be commenting much! I only know what I’ve heard from some piano players who had a Suzuki teacher in the past. So actually, I wonder if Suzuki method for strings is a little different from Suzuki method for piano…
ShiroKuro Not mean-spirited at all. I would like to see if those who follow Molly's methods can learn a new song in a week and play it better than those who do not follow Molly's methods.
My labeling is shorthand, how I feel about the whole thing, and some others on this forum feel the same.
I guess this forum is open for comments, but not if a select group decides it's not.
It appears, to me, that those who cling to Molly's scripture are perhaps just a little too defensive when it comes to hearing criticism. People may use sarcasm as a subtle way to point out opposing views, or that the concept in question may not float everyone's boat. Judging by the reaction of those who think Molly is spot on, it certainly feels like when cult members are asked difficult questions. Therefore I think those labels, Mollyism, Mollyites, Mollyists, and any other way one might call it, are accurate. I think Molly's "teachings" are a long winded detour to conventional practice methods propped up with pseudo-science psychobabble. Others, obviously, think otherwise.
If I am kicked out of the forum for what I've said, it will be the equivalent of burning me at the stake for being a heretic, and will prove what I've been saying about the whole thing all along.
@PianoMonk please note that I'm not the only one pushing back on your post and your choice of tone. Take a look up the thread if you don't know what I'm talking about.
Please note that the problem is not commenting on the forum or in this thread. The problem is when you move from criticizing an approach to criticizing, and directing sarcasm at, the people who are discussing said approach.
For the record, I am speaking here in my position as moderator. This thread has been flagged by other members and people have posted directly in the thread about their concerns.
So I'm asking you to take that to heart.
PianoMonk I would like to see if those who follow Molly's methods can learn a new song in a week and play it better than those who do not follow Molly's methods.
Have you read any of her material? If you had, you would know that she nowhere says anything about learning a piece (or song, in your parlance) in a week. As a number of people have stated, the time to learn a piece is not shortened--there are, after all, breaks of days and weeks built in--but it is more efficient, i.e., more pieces can be learned or, for longer works, sections or movements can be practiced as separate pieces.
PianoMonk I would like to see if those who follow Molly's methods can learn a new song in a week and play it better than those who do not follow Molly's methods.
I addressed the practicality and sense of that. Did you see my post? I'd be interested in your thoughts on that.
Ok, ok... I give... It all started as a bit of tongue-in-cheek wind-up. I thought some of you would see the humor in the religious/cult parallels, gimmicks of the past, etc. But then, such resistance... well it was hard to resist. I've probably made some enemies for life, like people do when they find out you're a Buddhist, not a Baptist, or that you voted for the other guy. Sorry that some took offense.
Yes, I've read everything of Molly's that was available for free. How do you think I formed my opinion of what she's offering?
The contest idea (which I still think would be fun) was/is to see if learning a song, (something like Mile's Davis' Blue In Green) would be played any better by those who find Molly's methods useful than those who do not. Admittedly, not a very scientific exercise; just a bit of fun. And to see if some would embrace the label that I sarcastically applied to those who subscribe to Molly's, er teachings, which I will not repeat here under threat of moderator, or potential banishment from planet PianoTell. (Although, I could probably benefit from finding a few extra hours a week.)
I see now that we can say, "Boy, that's one ugly hat." But can't say, "You have lousy taste for buying such an ugly hat." I'm fine with that. I've said before, that I'm glad some of you find Molly's stuff useful. I hope it gives you what you need to learn to play the piano.
If I am kicked out of the forum for what I've said, it will be the equivalent of burning me at the stake for being a heretic, and will prove what I've been saying about the whole thing all along.
Exactly. When people are so quick to shut down opposing views it is reminiscent of dictatorships who expel or imprison people with dissenting political views. It's strange that a site which is based in America, a place known as "the land of the free", is not keen on free speech unless people tow the party line. Anyway, you need not worry @PianoMonk because I don't think you're the real target here - that's me, obviously. Because I committed two heinous crimes 1) I suggested that maybe if people spent less time "Mollying" (a term used by Pallas upthread) and more time practising, they might progress just as well, and 2) I dared to laugh at your wry humour and agree with your very well worded and logical posts.
As for labels, MG fans are not alone in being labelled, this happens with many fan groups. For instance, Gary Numan fans are known as "Numanoids" and Taylor Swift fans are labelled "Swifties" - labels which those fans happily embrace. I've never heard any of them taking offence at those labels, instead they embrace their monikers with good humour (something sorely lacking on this thread).
"Don't let's ask for the moon, we have the stars." (Final line from Now,Voyager, 1942)
PianoMonk ..... to see if learning a song, (something like Mile's Davis' Blue In Green) would be played any better by those .....
I don't think you read my post addressing the practicality/sense of this and you probably can't find it, so here it is again.
(1) Everybody here has different abilities, different backgrounds, different experience. So if somebody who started piano half a year ago, and someone else who has a solid background with 10 years of study, both participate, the results will reflect that background, rather than recently embracing a new approach or not.
(2) The actual question is whether an individual has been practising in an ineffective, time-consuming manner with few results - and if that individual can start having better results over a shorter timespan. The only competition you can have is an individual person's past and present vis-a-vis different approaches they are using. It's "person A present" vs. "person A past" --- -not person A vs. person B.
Does this make sense?
I am not following MG's method because what she presents includes things I learned, and is missing things I learned. The goals addressed are different than the goals that I have. What remains is that if anyone has been doing ineffective things, then changing that may improve things. It may not be those particular things.
PianoMonk (something like Mile's Davis' Blue In Green)
Immediately - I'd SUCK recording something like that. I have no feel for jazz; I'm so square that a table appears round next to me and while by now I know things like to "not clap on the wrong beat", I have feel for it. My performance in comparison to yours, or someone who grew up with this kind of music and owns the language, would not reflect how effective my practice approach is, compared to yours or theirs. It would reflect that background, and those (lacking) abilities.
That's a more concrete example of what I was trying to say in my previous post.
PianoMonk Please re-read my last post. (Which may very well be the last)
Here's hoping that all of you find ways, any way at all, to find joy in learning to play the piano.
I've read yours. But have you read mine?
PianoMonk I don't think you read any of the comments refuting the ideas in your posts. Or you didn't understand them, or just chose to ignore them.
twocats To address earlier points in the thread: she doesn't have to have coached the best or to be a world-class musician. Her teachings are about how to be more efficient and spend less time to achieve the same or better results.
Quoting myself here. Her methods are about personal improvement and learning efficiency based on how the brain works.
Some of her advice has helped me and I look forward to trying other things that she has suggested. I'm grateful that the research exists and that she put it out there in consise form, tailored to musicians. If there's something I find doesn't work for me, then I won't do it. It's all a personal journey and the only comparison I need to make is with my past self.
Pallas My intention was never to "divide people or put them down" - that is just your own (mis)interpretation.
One day I saw this thread and a thought occurred to me, so I posted it. There was no hidden agenda. People did not share my view, that's fine, we don't all have to agree on things and I do not feel insecure about my choices. PianoMonk recently posted some views which I agreed with, and I enjoyed his humorous take on things so I responded on the thread. You may dislike our opinions and not appreciate our humour, but it is a stretch to call our posts disrespectful. However, you clearly have a problem with me and have done everything in your power to make things uncomfortable for me, including reporting me to the mods in the hope that I'll be banned from this site. In short, you have turned into the very sort of person that you so often complain of - a bully.
"Don't let's ask for the moon, we have the stars." (Final line from Now,Voyager, 1942)
