• twocats

  • Post #169
  • Edited

One thing that Molly's videos really helped me with was learning how important breaks are for the brain's learning process (she takes 2 weeks at the end of her ~4 week schedule!), thus eliminating any minor guilt that I had from having a very erratic practice schedule. My natural weeks or months-long breaks are actually beneficial!! I just need to incorporate consistent 10-second microbreaks into my practice to help lock things in better.

I think a great strategy for me is giving myself TONS of lead time for learning a new piece (like 6-12 months). I can start and get familiarized by reading through it a few times and then come back to it way later. When an actual deadline approaches (playing chamber music with others or performing at a casual playing night) and I need to get serious about practicing, suddenly everything feels more natural and easy, and I haven't even spent all that much time on practice yet.

I'm experiencing this right now. I had promised to play a Beethoven cello sonata with a friend about a year ago and it was not good enough invite her over until recently. I was just reading through it from time to time because I was focusing on other stuff. But now we set a date and I'm seriously working on the Beethoven and I'm just astounded at how easy it is now!

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  • rsl12

  • Post #171

I've split this discussion into two threads. The original purpose of Animisha's post was to gather the opinions of people who have used Molly Gerbain's methods for the last 7 months. I tried my best to keep those posts in this thread. Everything else has been moved here:

Discussing Molly Gebrian (Splinter Discussion of "Molly Gebrian 7 Months Later")

It was a difficult discussion to split! Let me know if I made any glaring mistakes. Also, let's try to keep this thread on topic, and use the linked one for all other discussion.

rsl12 unlocked the discussion .

Thanks 9again) @rsl12 !!

Ok, so back to the topic at hand... I'll start.

First of all, seven months on and I still haven't finished the book..... 😅 So that's my first priority.... 😃

a month later

Today I made a first recording of Tchaikovsky's In Church. It is an RCM grade 5 piece, and my level is grade 4, not grade 5. However, it went very well, because this piece is very suitable for a Molly schedule. I started ages ago, my first section was learning four RH chords. In all, I think I made 13 HS sections, patiently practising just those sections that were scheduled for the day and nothing else. Then it was time for HT and I made new sections and once again practised these with a Molly schedule. Finally, I started playing through.

I have been surprised by how smooth everything has been. Without the Molly schedules, I would have struggled so much more - because I would have tried to practise more than I could manage. Or, to be exact, I would have practised what I just could manage - and just managing means to me, making lots of mistakes.

The big take-away for me is, start a long, long time before you think a piece should be ready.

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... feeling like the pianist on the Titanic ...

    Animisha The big take-away for me is, start a long, long time before you think a piece should be ready.

    I live by this rule! 🙂

      Animisha Well done Ani, that sounds like a great result! Despite my cynicism towards MG, I'm happy to hear that you found her methods useful. 😀 Have you any plans to upload this piece?

      "Don't let's ask for the moon, we have the stars." (Final line from Now,Voyager, 1942)

          Nightowl Have you any plans to upload this piece?

          Thank you Nightowl! I have only made a first recording, and will sent it to my feedback teacher. For this recording, I have not yet added the pedals. So the final recording will still take some time.

          PS Please use my full name and not an abbreviation. 🙂

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          ... feeling like the pianist on the Titanic ...

              Animisha OK, will do, @Animisha. 🙂

              "Don't let's ask for the moon, we have the stars." (Final line from Now,Voyager, 1942)

                Nightowl Despite my cynicism towards MG,

                Do you really mean cynicism? I can understand skepticism but cynicism seems rather harsh…

                    Sgisela Well, since you ask - a bit of both, to be honest. However, despite my reservations I was pleased to hear that Animisha found that the MG method had helped her to learn a challenging piece - that was the main point I was intending to put across. It was intended to be positive, while acknowledging that my overall belief remains the same (see previous posts on other threads for reasons).

                    "Don't let's ask for the moon, we have the stars." (Final line from Now,Voyager, 1942)

                      Animisha The big take-away for me is, start a long, long time before you think a piece should be ready.

                      Today I went back to some of the piano quartet movements that I had shelved for several months and they were feeling so much better! The first time I read through them I was like "am I in over my head?". Then in the following weeks they didn't feel quite so overwhelming. Now they're in the "I can totally do this, I just need to put in the hours" bucket.

                      I feel like the progress is "free" if you put in a couple of weeks of practice and then come back to it later. In the meantime you can work on other stuff and you won't get bored practicing the same thing every day 🙂

                        This thread popping back up is reminding me that I need to get back to this book to finish it... I've been reading the Piano Girl book but I'm almost done, so then I'll return to MG.

                        I have these as e-books on my phone (along with the Inner Game of Music) and I generally read them at night after piano practice and before bed... I last maybe 5 minutes before I start falling asleep so my reading progress is pretty slow! 😅

                        I'm glad this thread has come alive again. I was super busy at the time "stuff was happening". This thread is meant for those who are working with what MG teaches, with the idea broached that this who are not working with the material should not be posting here. But that was due to what was happening. I am interested in what is happening, and if sticking with the intent of the thread, maybe it's ok to post reactions here.

                        I was happy to read @Animisha 's experience. Fantastic. The important thing for me is that you tried ways of working on music that were different than how you have been working, and this led to different and better results. I can relate to that, because quite a while back now I questioned how I was working on music, made major changes from the resources i had at that time, and it made a huge difference.

                          keystring Fantastic. The important thing for me is that you tried ways of working on music that were different than how you have been working, and this led to different and better results.

                          Yes, that was the case, thank you!

                          keystring because quite a while back now I questioned how I was working on music, made major changes from the resources i had at that time, and it made a huge difference.

                          Would you like to share the major changes you made? If it is too long for a small digression in this thread, maybe in a new thread?

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                          ... feeling like the pianist on the Titanic ...

                                Animisha Would you like to share the major changes you made?

                                I'll try to give a history. This goes back 20 years. It began a few years in of violin lessons. (1) working on a piece for weeks with no improvement, always working on the whole piece, all things. One day in disgust I dropped it, and worked on one technical issue; invented exercises, did so the whole week, never touching the piece. In next lesson, I played that piece I'd ignored much better than ever before. (2) another piece, always stuck at the start of the cadenza; failed, every lessons, for a month. This time I worked only on the measure where I was stuck, finding why I was stuck and a way to practise. I then circled every passage that had the same pattern (modulated) and did the same thing. Then made copies, and circled the 2nd-hardest thing, 3rd hardest thing and did the same. I practised fragments, and felt guilty for practising fragments, like I was "violating" the beauty of music. Later I learned that this is what musicians do. 😃

                                Both these times I went from long practising for weeks with no progress, to shorter sessions doing "unmusical" things or fragments, with huge progress within days. How I practised changed radically. I learned from some musicians, for example, to play everything with like thick vanilla, add expression, and if it slips, go back to vanilla (that instrument) = stages. I also learned about short sessions when remediating or getting a new skill, since you'll go into bad habits if you tire, and attention span is short for that. Shortly after that I got a piano which I had played decades before self-taught.

                                With the piano I encountered a teacher: I was seeking ways to practice that were effective for getting the skills, and it was part of what he did. The "fragmented" thing I had invented turned out to be "chunking. There was "layering" of skills, bringing in what you had, waiting to bring in a skill you didn't yet have. Example: play both voices evenly - for one voice louder than the other, maybe have one super loud, the other super soft while getting coordinate - later do dynamics. Short sessions: or in longer sessions, keep switching what you focus on. Allow your body & nervous system to make changes over time and after sleep (over days).

                                That was my journey. I think you'll see why what I've read and watched here and there with MG was not new to me; they are variants of some of the things I learned.

                                  Thank you so much for your story Keystring! Yes, most of what you have written resonates very well with Molly's approach. Very interesting to read.

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                                  ... feeling like the pianist on the Titanic ...

                                  Nightowl MG seems to have collated well established techniques, added some embellishments and wrapped them up in a shiny new wrapper.

                                  That's not true, she's a neuroscientist and is taking the research on learning and applying it to music. Of course some of it ends up supporting already established techniques, but the specifics of what she gets into (e.g. the timing of microbreaks, her suggested practice schedule) are based on neuroscience research and then applied to music learning. You're only seeing the correlation, not the causation.

                                  From her website:

                                  I use my background in cognitive neuroscience to translate the research on learning and memory into practical, actionable solutions musicians can use to practice and perform more effectively.

                                  Anyway, this is going back to the original reason for the thread being split-- this thread is not to argue about whether Dr. Molly's methods are legit, it's to see what those actually using her methods are getting (or not getting) out of it. As someone who does not follow Dr. Molly's work, you're welcome to comment on that other thread with your opinions, but let's please keep this one on topic.

                                  @keystring, this is not meant to be directed at you... just want to clarify that it's interesting to hear how you figured things out on your own. But for those who only have criticisms of Dr. Molly's methods without actually trying them, this is not the thread for that.

                                      Nightowl The original purpose of Animisha's post was to gather the opinions of people who have used Molly Gerbain's methods for the last 7 months. The discussion of the merits of MG's approach is best done in the linked thread:

                                      https://forum.pianotell.com/d/1511-discussing-molly-gebrian-splinter-discussion-of-molly-gebrian-7-months-later/142

                                      This thread is really meant for people who have used her methods to discuss their opinions of it.