Two versions of Clair de Lune

ShiroKuro

I believer we talked in another thread about this version of Clair de Lune by Victor Borge, but I keep listening to it and I just absolutely love it. When I talked about it with my teacher at our last lesson, she said she thinks CdL is well within my playable range in terms of difficulty… I think she may be overestimating me but that remains to be seen…

Anyway, here is the version by Borge, along with a more contemporary version by Rousseau. I’m struck by how different they sound. CdL is one of those pieces that I’ve always ”known” and liked but never was particularly interested in playing. But hearing the version by Borge just stayed with me and I decided to try to learn it.

Hearing the version by Rousseau, it strikes me as very sterile. It's too precise, too clean, too sterile. And I don't really care if I ever listen to it again. Victor Borge's Clair de Lune, on the other hand, I am obsessed with. I can't listen to it enough.

Victor Borge:

Rousseau

I’m also curious about what other people think about these two versions. I sort of wondered if Borge's style of playing here is not currently "in vogue" in the classical piano world, but I don't know because I don't really know what's "in vogue" (like, I don't know, how would Lang Lang or Yuja Wang play CdL?)

Anyway I’m curious if anyone else has any thoughts about it. 🙂

ShiroKuro

Clair de Lune played by Victor Borge with strings

Simonb

Hi ShiroKuro

You'll be surprised to know I don't really know Clair de Lune. A few bits of it were vaguely familiar, but I had to look it up to remind myself it was Debussy. Shows how ignorant I am about a lot of classical Piano music!

The Borge solo version is all I listened to in full. Once I'd heard that I didn't need to hear another version. That style (whatever that is) of playing might not be in vogue now, but I don't care about that. I have no time for musical bigots. There's someone on PW who is forever promoting the merits of older generations of Pianists (who were great) and running down relatively modern Pianists (like Brendel).

You're right about the Rousseau version. It is sterile, I lasted about 30secs. I have the same problem with a lot of music in other genres. Rock/Pop music has been over-produced and compressed to hell (though I don't really understand what compression is) for decades. I was so impressed to hear that Billy Joel recorded his Vocals and played his Piano parts at the same time in that recent Rick Beato interview.

All that matters is that you, or I, like it, or not. Other peoples opinions are like..... , everyones got one. People may say this version doesn't quite follow the sheet music in some pedantic way, or that it is too fast (or slow) at certain points, and they may be technically correct and I don't care a jot.

End of rant 😀

Cheers

ShiroKuro

Simonb I enjoyed your rant!!

I'm not worried about playing something in a style "not in vogue," but I'm curious about whether my "sense" of the style is accurate or not.

As for the Rousseau version, it might be instructive to look at his hands, but it's not a version I would refer to for playing hints!!

ranjit

I don't think anyone considers Rosseau to be very musical. The Victor Borge sounds great to me. The only complaint some might have is that it sounds theatrical, but I think they are just secretly jealous lol

pianoloverus

Peterson explains why he think Rousseau performance is poor

ShiroKuro

ranjit theatrical

Maybe that's what I'm thinking of as sounded a little bit like a style from a previous era.

@pianoloverus thanks so much for that video! If I'm remembering right, I think he does nice videos. I look forward to watching it later.

Since he has this critique video, it would be interesting to see him discuss a version he likes (although maybe he does in this video, I will find out later!)

BartK

@ShiroKuro If you want to get ideas for your own interpretation then I recommend good recordings by highly regarded artists such as this one

Don't listen to the first random results from YouTube. Those usually suck because the algorithm promotes popularity rather than quality.

danno858

BartK This is a really great recording of the piece

ShiroKuro

Thanks for the link, @BartK ! I need to listen to it again, but it was really gorgeous.

BartK Don't listen to the first random results from YouTube. Those usually suck because the algorithm promotes popularity rather than quality.

Yeah. I sort of chose Rousseau on purpose though, because he's about as far from Borge's playing as you can get.

twocats

ShiroKuro Victor Borge's rendition might be the loveliest recording of Clair de Lune that I've heard! It's like you can hear the moonlight under his fingers.

ShiroKuro

twocats you can hear the moonlight under his fingers.

Indeed ❤️

BTW I played through the first 15 measures the other day, and then yesterday I played through the part where the LH pattern changes to the sweeping arpeggios.

It’s hard but I think it’s do-able. I decided to put it aside until I start my fall semester lessons, partly so I can finish what I’m working on right now but also partly so I can work on it with my new teacher and hopefully avoid cementing any bad habits or fingering choices.

But even just sightreading it (i.e., poking at the notes awkwardly and haltingly), it was so beautiful. Hearing those harmonies coming out from my own fingers, from my own piano, was glorious.

Stub

I recently started learning Clair de Lune. I had piano lessons for 10+ years but don't have a teacher now that we've moved cross country. I do still hear my teacher's voice in my head, though. We'll see how it goes!

I'm also bring back Reverie and Arabesque No 1 to balance out the newness of the CdL. It's all Debussy, so not balanced composer-wise, but I love Debussy and I don't care!

ShiroKuro

Stub Reverie and Arabesque No 1

I would love to play these two pieces as well!

Please keep us posted on your progress and I’ll do the same. Should we start a separate CdL or Debussy thread?

Jane

Clair de Lune is so beautiful that it's impossible to butcher.

But the first question one might consider is whether to more-or-less play the rhythms Debussy wrote, or just to emote freely.

Victor plays Victor, not Claude. (Does that make me a bigot, Simon? 😉 So be it.) The first three thirds in his video have no relation to the note values Debussy wrote.

From a playing-the-notes standpoint, the only really tricky bit is the left hand arpeggio in the middle.

From a playing-it-as-written standpoint, the rhythms on the first two pages are tricky. It's mostly 3-against-2, but so many pianists just play those parts randomly.

Aside from the rhythms, the piece is an exercise in tone coloring and legato.

I'm fond of Pires' recording. She is not the least bit mechanical in her tempo, but those subtle rhythms of Debussy are respected.

Impossible to butcher. Difficult to play accurately but not pedantically.

Simonb

Hi Jane

I could butcher it!

Not at all, you're pointing out something that's probably true (I don't own the sheet music, so can't check, happy to take your word). What you're not saying (directly - but maybe you're thinking it?) is, he doesn't stick to the note values so therefore it's **** (swear word of your choice).

It's an interpretation, and it's fine to say I don't like it. That's an opinion. When people say they don't like an interpretation, but then continue on to rubbish all aspects of the playing over sometimes relatively small things, it does start to irritate me :-).

But that's just my opinion!

Cheers

ShiroKuro

Jane Clair de Lune is so beautiful that it's impossible to butcher.

Yes! I think this is why it’s so satisfying to just sit and sightread through it, because the sound it creates is absolutely gorgeous, even when I’m playing in a way that, with any other piece, would be called “butchering” 😃

Jane Victor plays Victor, not Claude.

He certainly does! I’m biased because I love Victor Borge as a humorist, so seeing/hearing him play like this, no joking around, made it even more moving to me.

The first three thirds in his video have no relation to the note values Debussy wrote.

Yes, and he can get away with that because he’s a masterful pianist. But probably I could not get away with something like that!

From a playing-the-notes standpoint, the only really tricky bit is the left hand arpeggio in the middle.

Yes, this is the section that worries me the most. I haven’t worked on it yet (just sightread through it a bit) so I can’t tell yet if it’s going to be too hard for me or not.

I'm fond of Pires' recording. She is not the least bit mechanical in her tempo, but those subtle rhythms of Debussy are respected.

Yes, I just listened! Thank you so much for posting it! Her perfomance is absolute stunning.

I probably need a better vocabulary because all I can come up with is “gorgeous” 🙂

ShiroKuro

Simonb I could butcher it!

Same.
😂😂

pianoloverus

I think one can find countless butchered recordings of the piece on YT because this piece is so popular and often played by amateurs who are not really ready for it or are learning it without a teacher. Of course, one person's idea of butchered is another person's idea of acceptable or even good. I like Borge's playing of this piece and all pieces he plays without any comedy added, and I'm sure he knows he's not following the score precisely. I prefer other recordings where the rhythms Debussy wrote are followed more precisely.

ShiroKuro

pianoloverus all pieces he plays without any comedy added

I have only heard a few things like this by him, I'll need to look for more.

BTW so far my favorite versions of CdL are the second Borge version in this thread (w strings) and the one @Jane posted, by Maria Joao Pires.

🙂