Hey Alexis Ffrench fans

ShiroKuro

So how many Alexis Ffrench fans are there here? I am desperate to get the score for Miracles, but it’s not available. Tunescribers will transcribe it for $112, which is just a wee bit over my usual sheet music budget 😅

But it occurred to me that if a few other people wanted to the score, maybe we could split the cost. (I am inspired by what @Pallas has done with the upcoming zoom session).

Anyway, if you’re not familiar with Miracles, give a listen.

Sgisela

ShiroKuro Have you tried using the Contact page on his website to see if he has plans on releasing the sheet music?

MusicMe

Sgisela I have written to him on instagram several times over the years asking when he would be publishing the sheet music to "Radiate" for solo piano, as played in his YouTube channel. One would think that when you have fans of your music asking for sheet music that it would be motivating to do so, not to mention the financial gain.

ShiroKuro

@Pallas thank you for the offer! Let's see if other folks are interested.

Re publishing his sheet music, there are some pieces of his that seem to never be released as sheet music. I'm not sure why, esp. since he does publish a huge amount of his music in score books and as individual pieces of digital sheet music

@Sgisela yes, on his contact page there are separate emails for both "management" and "publishing" and I've emailed both. No response so far...

ShiroKuro

Pallas It could be an intellectual property issue.

I'm sure that happens a lot, but I don't think that's the case for Ffrench, because these are his original compositions, and I'm pretty sure Miracles hasn't been used in any film etc.

With Ffrench's September Song (an original composition, despite there being other others with the same title), he never released his own sheet music version, and at some point someone must have paid full price (i.e, $100-300) to have it transcribed, then Tunescribers started selling it (which is when I bought it) and now that version is available for sale.

Having played Sept Song, I always suspected that he improvised it and that's why he never released the sheet music.

I can't decide if Miracles sounds like it's improvised though, I kind of don't think so....

Pallas I have to buy pieces from hobby arrangers!

Are there any arrangers or websites that you use for this? (I want to make sure I'm not missing anything as I hunt around for options to get the score for Miracles...)

ShiroKuro

Ummm.... so look at this video, it certainly looks like that's sheet music on the music desk there.....

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?ref=saved&v=283202797725551

I'm gonna message him on FB too....

ShiroKuro

Umm.... So, I actually sent him a Facebook message on Sept. 23, 2023 asking him to release the score for Miracles.
😂

He (or more likely, the social media manager of his FB account) opened the message on Oct. 1 2023, but no response.

Sigh. I messaged him again just now.

In the meantime, hopefully when more people come online here, there will be more interest in chipping in....
(Also, I'm desperate, I'm gonna ask over at PW too....)

ShiroKuro

Pallas They vary in quality

That is the concern isn't it. I would want a transcription of the original, not an "arrangement." I have searched for covers of Miracles and not really found other people playing it...

ShiroKuro

Pallas so it's possible they're sitting on an option to license it.

This could very well be! I wish they wouldn't sit on it though!! (cue whiny teenager voice "I want it now!" 😅

Pallas If you commission a transcription, or we do, if you crowd-fund, someone will still need to read it against the audio to make sure it's good.

When I purchased a score from Tunescribers (they had already made it, so it was $10 instead of $300!), I was able to check it myself and they changed part of it for me.

Pallas The transcriber could be one of my daughter's friends from college who do this kind of thing for gig work.

I would assume that's how most of the sites work, it's like Uber for sheet music! 😛

ShiroKuro

@MusicMe I'm glad I'm not the only one hounding him for sheet music! 😅

Unsteady9722

I'm interested @ShiroKuro. Though my concern is how good is the transcription service? They say it's a week turn around. I'd be willing to bet that they use an automated application that's using "AI" as a first pass and then do minor corrections. This is a bit more involved than a standard pop piece. My worry is that it's given to one of their musicians who has a 9-5 like us and isn't able to adequately transcribe the entire piece due to time, effort, skill.

Regarding why he wouldn't release it - once it's out there in sheet music, there's no control over who uploads it to Youtube, SheetMusicPlus, Musescore, etc. I imagine that the creative control over the piece is important to him/his team.

ShiroKuro

Unsteady9722 Though my concern is how good is the transcription service?

I have a Tunescribers transcript and it's ok. If we go forward, I will ask about how they do it. An "AI first pass" isn't a problem IMO, what matters is how much effort they put into polishing after that first pass!

Unsteady9722 Regarding why he wouldn't release it - once it's out there in sheet music, there's no control over who uploads it to Youtube, SheetMusicPlus, Musescore, etc.

Considering that he releases tons of sheet music for his other pieces, I would imagine that this isn't the reason. There just seem to be some pieces he hasn't released. I wish I knew why. Maybe they think this one won't sell as well so it's not worth the effort? No idea.

I would love to know how much editing his scores receive before being released.

Unsteady9722

ShiroKuro I have a Tunescribers transcript and it's ok. If we go forward, I will ask about how they do it. An "AI first pass" isn't a problem IMO, what matters is how much effort they put into polishing after that first pass!

Oh I 100% agree; I definitely have no problem with a AI first pass, but am more concerned with the time someone devotes after it, coupled with their skill. If you trust Tunescribers, then I'm good with it.

I actually already took a first pass to get a midi file from the track...I just don't posses the skill/time to modify it to be proper rather than this ugliness:

Anyways, keep me included on your list for interest and willing to split costs.

kanadajin

Interesting thread. Several excellent points raised. I can certainly relate to wanting a transcription of the original song and not an arrangement which is often sadly watered down.

As stated, the final step of validating a just transcribed piece against the original audio is paramount (!) and I have the impression that in many cases, this important quality control task is not done with very critical ears (just my experience in the past) although there certainly are notable exceptions.

Any of you might have used the Transcribe! software in the past? It works quite well in my opinion and may provide what you are looking for it seems to me. I do not know this composer nor this song but had a cursory listen of 2 or 3 segments of the video link above. It really does not seem all that complicated from a transcription point of view. There seems to be some reverb effect in the recording which might « muddy » things up a little bit (spectrum analysis clarity).

(BTW This song would not be an appropriate first introduction for using the software, better start with something more basic from a harmonic perspective. Practice makes perfect 🙂)

ShiroKuro

@Unsteady9722 that's super interesting... but also, to my eye, it's not what I consider sightreadable... I can't exactly explain why... Maybe it's all the ties??
It's related to the difficulty of the song. Later, I'll try to find something of his that's similar in difficulty and style and share part of the score that's published as a comparison.

Kanadajin, I don't think I'm up to the task of learning a software program to transcribe it myself. Does that program have any automated steps?

kanadajin

ShiroKuro

ShiroKuro Kanadajin, I don't think I'm up to the task of learning a software program to transcribe it myself. Does that program have any automated steps?

No it does not, one still has to do the all the work. Many analogies can be made, but one I like is this: say you are a roofer and your job is to install shingles. Way back when, you would climb onto the roof with your hammer and a box of nails and use your brute force to nail the shingles in place by hand. Of course nowadays we have pneumatic nail guns (is that how they are called?). So you are now able to do the same job a lot faster, with less effort and usually with better shingle positioning accuracy due to less physical stress over the working hours. But YOU still are doing the work - i.e. the shingles do not install themselves just because you have a nail gun. Same thing with Transcribe!

You are right in that there is a learning curve with Transcribe! (as with pretty well all software, no surprise there). It also does require some musical knowledge to use of course. One « straw man » rough and imperfect ability gauge for example would be: from the recording, are you able to determine the time and key signatures of the song? (I do not have perfect ear pitch so in my case I need to be at the piano to figure this out). In the affirmative, you probably are a good candidate for using this program. Again, this is only an approximation YMMV.

ShiroKuro

@kanadajin there is zero possibility of me being able to do any transcription myself. I am a pretty good sightreader, and very good at playing (and learning) from a score. Without a score, I'm lost.

@Unsteady9722 one of the places I contacted said they'd give me a discount, so that place is quoting me $98. If we can get two other people, that would be about $25 each.

TBH the thought of paying $25 for a score makes me a little 😵but... I've been wanting this piece for a year now... Anyway, my point is, would you be willing at that price or would you prefer it to be lower?

ShiroKuro

Hmm I think we’ll need 6 or 7 people then. There’s three of us here but I’m not optimistic about getting many more. And no one has responded to my post over at PW (where there used to be a kind of active Alexis Ffrench thread.)

Maybe I should check out the r/piano group over at reddit?

ShiroKuro

Also maybe I should post here in the Learner’s Lounge? Cross posting is ok right?

Josephine

I wanted to try if I can learn it by ear so we can make our own transcription but I'm already stuck at the second left hand chord. I can hear the sound of the chord but not the exact notes and exact order. Can someone else hear it?